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ΟΧΙ σε εθνική υποχώρηση στο σκοπιανό

Posted by olympiada στο Φεβρουαρίου 8, 2018

Γράφει ο δικηγόρος Γεράσιμος Παναγιωτάτος – Τζάκης

            Τους τελευταίους μήνες αναθερμάνθηκαν οι πιέσεις που υφίσταται ο Ελληνισμός για να δεχθεί στο σκοπιανό μια λύση αντίθετη προς την ιστορική αλήθεια, μια λύση που θα ανοίγει διάπλατα τις αλυτρωτικές βλέψεις των γειτόνων μας και θα μπορεί να χρησιμοποιηθεί ως κακό προηγούμενο για την επιβολή υποχωρήσεων σε όλα τα εθνικά μας θέματα.

            Όπως ήταν αναμενόμενο, κι αυτή τη φορά το πολιτικό, δημοσιογραφικό και ακαδημαϊκό κατεστημένο των Αθηνών, οι διαχρονικοί κήρυκες του ενδοτισμού, αποδύθηκαν σε μια προσπάθεια διασποράς της ηττοπαθούς λογικής τους στην ελληνική κοινωνία, με ένα σαρδόνιο χαμόγελο ότι η οικονομική εξαθλίωση των μνημονίων και η κόπωση από την εκκρεμότητα του ζητήματος, θα οδηγούσαν το λαό σε αδιαφορία ή εύκολη υποταγή. «Ποιος ο λόγος να αντιστεκόμαστε, όταν πάνω από εκατό χώρες έχουν ήδη αναγνωρίσει τα Σκόπια ως Μακεδονία;», είναι το πιο γνωστό από τα επιχειρήματα που χρησιμοποιούν τα ανωτέρω παπαγαλάκια, για να περάσουν στους πολίτες την αίσθηση ματαιότητας του αγώνα. Aντιστρέφουμε, λοιπόν, το ερώτημα: «Ποιος ο λόγος που ο διεθνής και ευρωπαϊκός συρφετός πιέζει εκβιαστικά την Ελλάδα αυτή να αναγνωρίσει το κρατίδιο με όνομα που θα περιέχει τον όρο Μακεδονία ή παράγωγό του, αφού λοιπόν τόσες χώρες το έχουν αναγνωρίσει;».

Η πραγματικότητα είναι ότι αυτό συμβαίνει γιατί η ενδεχόμενη αναγνώριση από την Ελλάδα ως άμεσα ενδιαφερόμενη χώρα είναι αυτή που μετράει περισσότερο από όλες τις άλλες αναγνωρίσεις μαζί. Οι ισχυροί διεθνείς παράγοντες θέλουν να υποχρεώσουν το θύμα της προσπάθειας σφετερισμού της ιστορίας του, να βάλει την υπογραφή του και να εγκρίνει το σφετερισμό. Αυτό, άλλωστε, επιδιώκουν και στο κυπριακό: δεν τους αρκεί ότι επί 44 χρόνια κάνουν τα στραβά μάτια απέναντι στην Τουρκία και ανέχονται τα αποτελέσματα της τουρκικής εισβολής και κατοχής, αλλά εκβιάζουν τον κυπριακό ελληνισμό για να βάλει ο ίδιος την υπογραφή του στην απενοχοποίηση και νομιμοποίηση του εισβολέα και κατόχου, αποδεχόμενος ένα σχέδιο τύπου Ανάν.

Το δεύτερο επιχείρημα των παπαγαλακίων είναι ότι στα Σκόπια υπάρχει πλέον μια δήθεν μετριοπαθής κυβέρνηση. Ρωτάμε λοιπόν: Μήπως άρθηκε ο αλυτρωτισμός που περιέχεται στο Σύνταγμα, τη λοιπή νομοθεσία, τα σχολικά βιβλία, τους χάρτες και άλλα δημόσια έγγραφα των Σκοπίων; Μήπως άρθηκε το θέαμα των κιτς κατασκευών ψευδοϊστορίας και ψευδομεγαλείου του κρατιδίου και οι κλεψίτυπες ονομασίες δημοσίων κτιρίων και χώρων; Μήπως άλλαξε τακτική η πλευρά των Σκοπίων; Πριν από λίγο καιρό δεν είναι που ο Υπουργός Εξωτερικών Ντιμιτρόφ είπε «Μακεδόνες ήμασταν, είμαστε και θα είμαστε και δεν αλλάζουμε τίποτα»; Στην έναρξη της πρόσφατης διαπραγμάτευσης δεν ήταν που ο σκοπιανός διαπραγματευτής Ναουμόφσκι επιτέθηκε στο Νίμιτς και είπε ότι δεν δέχονται καμία ονομασία που δεν είναι σκέτα Μακεδονία γιατί είναι προσβλητικό γι’ αυτούς; Πριν λίγες μέρες δεν είναι που ο ίδιος ο Νίμιτς τους αποκάλεσε Μακεδόνες και διαβεβαίωσε ότι όλες οι προτάσεις του θα υιοθετούν τη βασική θέση της άλλης πλευράς και θα έχουν στόχο να ενισχυθεί η μακεδονική ταυτότητα και εθνικότητα; Πρόκειται για μια παρωδία διαπραγμάτευσης, ένα σκηνικό εμπαιγμού όπου ο υποτιθέμενος διαιτητής ομολογεί πανηγυρικά ότι αποκλειστικό μέλημά του είναι η μεροληψία υπέρ της μιας πλευράς.

Ενδεχόμενη υποχώρηση της Ελλάδας και αποδοχή ενός ονόματος για τα Σκόπια με τον όρο Μακεδονία ή παράγωγό του, θα νομιμοποιήσει την προσπάθεια σφετερισμού της ιστορίας μας, θα χρησιμοποιηθεί στο μέλλον ως φόρμουλα πιέσεων προς την Ελλάδα για να υποχωρήσει και στα υπόλοιπα εθνικά θέματα και θα ανοίξει το δρόμο για την ένταξη των Σκοπίων στην Ε.Ε. και στο ΝΑΤΟ. Όταν αυτά θα έχουν παγιωθεί, τα Σκόπια θα επανέλθουν ανενόχλητα και ενισχυμένα στην αλυτρωτική τους ρητορική και θα μπουν στο δρόμο της επιθετικότητας απέναντι στην πατρίδα μας, στα χνάρια της συμπεριφοράς άλλων γειτονικών μας χωρών.

Για όσους αμφιβάλλουν για τα ανωτέρω, υπενθυμίζω ότι πριν λίγους μήνες η κυβέρνηση των Σκοπίων αμόλησε σκυλιά στα σύνορα να κυνηγούν πρόσφυγες και έριξε φωτοβολίδες κρότου – λάμψης σε ελληνικό έδαφος. Κι όχι μόνο δεν υπέστη την παραμικρή κύρωση από τη διεθνή και ευρωπαϊκή κοινότητα, αλλά αντιθέτως όλοι οι ανωτέρω παράγοντες την επιβραβεύουν και πιέζουν με όλα τα μέσα για την είσοδο του κρατιδίου στην Ε.Ε. και στο ΝΑΤΟ. Πώς είναι δυνατό, λοιπόν, να υποχωρήσει η Ελλάδα δίνοντας τόσα χειροπιαστά πράγματα για να αγοράσει αέρα και ψευδαισθήσεις; Αφού τα Σκόπια θα έχουν πάρει τα πάντα, στη συνέχεια δεν θα τηρήσουν τίποτα από τα συμφωνηθέντα. Και η Ελλάδα θα μείνει τότε να διαμαρτύρεται με διεθνή διαβήματα αλλά θα είναι αργά, δεν θα την ακούει κανείς…

Η πατρίδα μας δεν πρέπει να δεχθεί να περιέχεται ο όρος Μακεδονία ή παράγωγό του στην ονομασία των Σκοπίων. Αν αυτό οδηγήσει σε μη λύση του προβλήματος στην παρούσα περίοδο, κανένα πρόβλημα για την Ελλάδα. Από μία κακή λύση που θα υποθηκεύσει ανεπιστρεπτί τη χώρα μας, προτιμότερη είναι η μη λύση, αφού αφήνει ανοιχτό το πεδίο να πετύχουμε μια δίκαιη λύση υπό καλύτερους συσχετισμούς στο μέλλον.

Οι Έλληνες πολίτες τα γνωρίζουν αυτά, γι’ αυτό υπάρχει η υπερήφανη αντίδρασή τους απέναντι στον εκβιασμό που υφίσταται η χώρα μας. Είναι στο χέρι του λαού μας να βγει στο προσκήνιο με ακόμα μεγαλύτερη αποφασιστικότητα και δυναμισμό. Να πυκνώσει τις πιέσεις του προς ολόκληρο το πολιτικό σύστημα. Να αποτρέψει μια εθνική υποχώρηση που, αν υπάρξει, θα δημιουργεί στο διηνεκές πολλαπλούς κινδύνους σε βάρος της πατρίδας μας.

9 Σχόλια to “ΟΧΙ σε εθνική υποχώρηση στο σκοπιανό”

  1. Παναγιωτησ Γιαννοπουλος said

    <>…Σας ενημερωνουμε οτι η επισημη ονομασια που δεχεται η Ελλαδα ειναι ΠΓΔΜ και το Μ στο τελος δεν ειναι Μαγιονεζα…

    <>….κανενα προβλημα απολυτωσ….140 χωρισ θα τη λενε σκετο μακεδονια για παντα.εμεισ θα τη λεμε ΠΓΔ Μακεδονια…..το συνταγμα και οι αλυτρωτισμοι θα παραμενουν………θα συνεχεισει ολοσ ο πλαντητησ να μασ δουλευει κανονικα…….και στο τελοσ οταν θα μοιρασουν τα σκοπια αναμεσα σε Αλβανια=τουρκια και Βουλγαρια.ττοτε θα τρεψουμε να δουμε τι πηγε στραβα………ποιοι <> εμποδισαν τη λυση και το διεθνοσ ρεζλιλι τησ χωρασ

    Μου αρέσει!

    • ιστορική αλήθεια said

      «καὶ καθ᾽ ἕν᾽ οὑτωσὶ περικόπτειν καὶ λωποδυτεῖν τῶν Ἑλλήνων, καὶ καταδουλοῦσθαι τὰς πόλεις ἐπιόντα….. ἀλλ᾽ οὐχ ὑπὲρ Φιλίππου καὶ ὧν ἐκεῖνος πράττει νῦν, οὐχ οὕτως ἔχουσιν, οὐ μόνον οὐχ Ἕλληνος ὄντος οὐδὲ προσήκοντος οὐδὲν τοῖς Ἕλλησιν, ἀλλ᾽ οὐδὲ βαρβάρου ἐντεῦθεν ὅθεν καλὸν εἰπεῖν, ἀλλ᾽ ὀλέθρου Μακεδόνος, ὅθεν οὐδ᾽ ἀνδράποδον σπουδαῖον οὐδὲν ἦν πρότερον πρίασθαι. , » –Δημοσθένης

      «ὁ δὲ τὸν μὲν τόπον τὸν Ἑλληνικὸν ὅλως εἴασε, τὴν δ᾽ ἐν Μακεδονίᾳ βασιλείαν κατασχεῖν ἐπεθύμησεν: ἠπίστατο γὰρ τοὺς μὲν Ἕλληνας οὐκ εἰθισμένους ὑπομένειν τὰς μοναρχίας, τοὺς δ᾽ ἄλλους οὐ δυναμένους ἄνευ τῆς τοιαύτης δυναστείας διοικεῖν τὸν βίον τὸν σφέτερον αὐτῶν. «– Ἰσοκράτης

      «τούτους μὲν δὴ ἐνταῦθα, τῷ δὲ ἐν Δωδώνῃ Διὶ Μακεδόνων ἀνέθηκεν αὐτῶν τὰς ἀσπίδας. ἐπιγέγραπται δὲ καὶ ταύταις:“αἵδε ποτ᾽ Ἀσίδα γαῖαν ἐπόρθησαν πολύχρυσον,
      αἵδε καὶ Ἕλλασιν δουλοσύναν ἔπορον.
      νῦν δὲ Διὸς ναῶ ποτὶ κίονας ὀρφανὰ κεῖται
      τᾶς μεγαλαυχήτω σκῦλα Μακεδονίας.» – Παυσανίας

      «διεδέξατο παρ᾽ αὐτοῦ τὴν ἀρχὴν Ἀλέξανδρος. οὗτος πάλιν ὑπολαβὼν βραχύ τι τῆς Ἑλλάδος ἔναυσμα καταλείπεσθαι περὶ τὴν Θηβαίων πόλιν, τίνα τρόπον αὐτὴν διέφθειρε, πάντας ὑμᾶς οἴομαι κατανοεῖν» — Πολύβιος

      Ούτε οι Μακεδόνες ήταν Έλληνες, ούτε Φιλέλληνες, ούτε η Μακεδονία, ποτέ, γη Ελληνική…. ανιστόρητοι!!!!!!!

      Κι ακόμα, αν ένας Έλληνας έχει το θάρρος να ερευνά την αλήθεια αμερόληπτος , ξαναρχίζουν οι αισχρολογίες…….

      …… Ο Έλληνας που ερευνά είναι προδότης

      ….. και αυτός που επαναλαμβάνει αμάσητα τα κοινά λεγόμενα είναι πατριώτης.

      Ο κάθε ξένος που διαφέρει από την αμελέτητη (Π)ιστορία μας είναι αμαθής, εσφαλμένος, πράκτορας, ή ανύπαρκτος

      ….. και ο καθένας που συμφωνεί, μέγας ιδιοφυής και παντογνώστης.

      Μου αρέσει!

      • Chris, a pureblooded GREEK said

        There is ABUNDANT HISTORICAL proof that the ANCIENT MACEDONIANS CONSIDERED THEMSELVES IN NO WAY kin to ANCIENT GREEKS AND THE SAME VICE-VERSA

        «Philip and his present conduct, though he is not only no Greek, nor related to the Greeks, but not even a barbarian from any place that can be named with honor, but a pestilent knave from Macedonia, whence it was never yet possible to buy a decent slave.» – Demosthenes

        » And the founder of your empire, although he aspired higher than did his fellow citizens and set his heart on a king’s power, was not minded to take the same road as others who set out to attain a like ambition. [107] For they endeavored to win this honor by engendering factions, disorder, and bloodshed in their own cities; he, on the other hand, held entirely aloof from Hellenic territory, and set his heart upon occupying the throne of Macedon. For he knew full well that the Hellenes were not accustomed to submit to the rule of one man, while the other races were incapable of ordering their lives without the control of some such power. And so it came about, owing to his unique insight in this regard, that his kingship has proved to be quite set apart from that of the generality of kings: for, because he alone among the Hellenes did not claim the right to rule over a people of kindred race – Isocrates

        » Anaxarchus commenced the discussion by saying that
        he considered Alexander much more worthy of being
        deemed a god than either Dionysus or Heracles, not only
        on account of the very numerous and mighty exploits which he had performed but also because Dionysus was only a Theban, in no way related to Macedonians ; and
        Heracles was an Argive, not at all related to them»
        – Arrian

        AS PER COUNTLESS ANCIENT GREEK!!! SOURCES BELOW. NOW, IF YOU WANT TO PROVE THAT THIS IS FALSE, PLEASE STATE YOUR SOURCES!! MAYBE YOUR FANATIC INDIGNATION WILL BE INCENTIVE ENOUGH TO PROVIDE YOUR SUPPOSED INFORMATION I HAVE BEEN ASKING FOR ALL ALONG.

        STILL WAITING FOR ANY!!! OF YOU TO PROVIDE ANY!!!! ORIGINAL HISTORICAL ANCIENT TEXTS THAT I CAN USE TO SUPPPORT THE HISTORICITY OF THE «GREEK» MACEDONIA. I ASSUME OF THE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE WHO CARE ENOUGH TO GO TO A DEMONSTRATION AT LEAST A PERCENT WILL BROWSE THIS SITE. I ASSUME OF YOU THOUSANDS AT LEASE A TENTH OF A PERCENT HAVE SOME!!!!!! HISTORICAL BACKING FOR YOUR HISTORICAL STANCE.

        IF YOU CARE AT ALL FOR GREECE, PLEASE SHARE IT!!!!!!! TIME IS SHORT SO I WILL ASK AGAIN UNTIL AN ANSWER IS FOUND BECAUSE I RATHER DEAL WITH YOUR HOLSTILITY THAN BE FORCED TO CONCLUDE FROM OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE THAT MACEDONIA WAS NEVER GREEK AT ALL.

        DONT TELL ME I DIDNT DO MY HOMEWORK. A FRACTION OF IT IS BELOW.

        I HAVE READ EVERY ANCIENT WRITER I CAN FIND AND NONE!!!!!!! SUPPORT MACEDONIA EVER BEING GREEK. NOR DOES ANY PRE-1910S MODERN HISTORIAN. NOR DOES KARAGATSIS WHOSE GREEK HISTORY BOOK WAS BANNED BY THE GOVT.

        MODERN BLOGS ARE USELESS UNLESS THEY HAVE ANCIENT WRITERS AS SOURCES. YOUR HYSTERIA AND EMAILED DEATH-THREATS ARE NOT OF BENEFIT TO MOTHER GREECE NOR DO THEY PROVE ANYTHING. IF YOU ACTUALLY BELIEVE WHAT YOU CLAIM, TAKE THE TIME TO POST SOURCED HISTORICAL INFORMATION WHICH SOMEONE OF YOU MUST HAVE TO BE SO CONVINCED!!!!!.

        A LITTLE OF MY HOMEWORK, just so you cannot accuse me of lying, as you do so frequently (more than you read in your lifetimes?????):

        ARISTOLE (Thx 2 a fellow blogger. Verified in Aristotle Politics):
        «in Sparta and Crete both the system of education and the mass of the laws are framed in the main with a view to war; and also among all the nations that are strong enough to expand at the expense of others, military strength has been held in honor, for example, among the Scythians, Persians, Thracians and Celts. Indeed among some peoples there are even certain laws stimulating military valor; for instance at Carthage, we are told, warriors receive the decoration of armlets of the same number as the campaigns on which they have served; and at one time there was also a law in Macedonia that a man who had never killed an enemy must wear his halter instead of a belt. Among Scythian tribes at a certain festival a cup was carried round from which a man that had not killed an enemy was not allowed to drink. Among the Iberians, a warlike race, they fix small spits in the earth round a man’s grave corresponding in number to the enemies he has killed. So with other races there are many other practices of a similar kind, some established by law and others by custom.» Macedonians are listed among foreign RACES not Greek Poleis. Its Scythians Thracians Persans Macedonians Celts. NOT Crete Spata Macedonia.

        ********************************************************

        HERODOTUS:
        » Then Amyntas answered- «O, Persians! we have no such custom as this;
        but with us men and women are kept apart. Nevertheless, since you,
        who are our lords, wish it, this also shall be granted to you.»
        »
        But sex-segregation was not practiced by the Greeks afaik, ex, the symposiums. Amyntas is the Macedonian king

        «For when Alexander wished to contend in the games,
        and had come to Olympia with no other view, the Greeks who were about
        to run against him would have excluded him from the contest- saying
        that Greeks only were allowed to contend, and not barbarians. But
        Alexander proved himself to be an Argive, and was distinctly adjudged
        a Greek; after which he entered the lists for the foot-race, and was
        drawn to run in the first pair.» But why would a Macedonian be suspected of not being a Greek (Barbaros) if Macedonia was unequivocally Greek? Can anyone PLEASE cite for me a case where a Spartan or Theban etc was suspect like this?

        » No sooner therefore did he reach Sardis with
        the Paeonians than he said to Darius, «What mad thing is this that
        thou hast done, sire, to let a Greek, a wise man and a shrewd, get
        hold of a town in Thrace, a place too where there is abundance of
        timber fit for shipbuilding, and oars in plenty, and mines of silver,
        » But if Thrace was Greek, how can a Greek getting hold of a town in it be noteworthy?

        » they, being Thessalians, were the first
        of the Hellenes who gave themselves over to the king; for Xerxes
        thought that they offered him friendship on behalf of their whole
        nation.» Never mind the ‘friendship’ offered him by the Macedonians a page earlier. Xerxes bridged the Hellespont. What did he do? Fly over Epirus, Thrace and Macedonia?

        » Mardonios having read that which the Oracles uttered, whatever
        that was, after this sent as an envoy to Athens Alexander the son of
        Amyntas, the Macedonian,…. Now of this Alexander the seventh ancestor[108] was that
        Perdiccas who first became despot of the Macedonians, and that in the
        manner which here follows:–From Argos there fled to the Illyrians
        three brothers of the descendents of Temenos, Gauanes, Aëropos, and
        Perdiccas; and passing over from the Illyrians into the upper parts of
        Macedonia they came to the city of Lebaia. There they became farmservants
        for pay in the household of the king, one pasturing horses,
        the second oxen, and the youngest of them, namely Perdiccas, the
        smaller kinds of cattle» So whatever Macedonians are, there are Illyrians between them and Greece?

        » the envoys from Sparta followed him forthwith and said: «… but let not
        Alexander the Macedonian persuade you, making smooth the speech of
        Mardonios; for these things are fitting for him to do, since being
        himself a despot he is working in league with a despot: for you
        however they are not fitting to do, if ye chance to be rightly minded;
        for ye know that in Barbarians there is neither faith nor truth at
        all.» So whatever Alexander is, Sparta is not impressed. The issue cannot be kingship as Sparta had kings. Also, why is BarbarianS plural. Mardonius is one, and it is from earlier in Alexander’s speech a personal offer.

        » And in the future do not thou appear before the Athenians with any such proposals as these, nor think that thou art rendering them good service in advising them to do
        that which is not lawful; for we do not desire that thou shouldest
        suffer anything unpleasant at the hands of the Athenians, who art
        their public guest and friend.» . To Alexander they thus made
        answer, but to the envoys from Sparta as follows: «That the
        Lacedemonians should be afraid lest we should make a treaty with the
        Barbarian was natural no doubt, but it seems to be an unworthy
        fear for … there is the bond of
        Hellenic race, by which we are of one blood and of one speech, the
        common temples of the gods and the common sacrifices, the manners of
        life which are the same for all;» So there is a blood bond with the Spartans but the Macedonian is just a guest?

        ********************************************************
        STRABO:

        » From Brentesium the sea is traversed by two passages to the opposite coast, one crossing to the Ceraunian Mountains and the adjacent coasts of the Epirus and Greece, the other to Epidamnus, which is the longer of the two, being 1800 stadia. Still this is habitually traversed, on account of the situation of the city being convenient for the nations of Illyria and Macedonia. » WTF? I’d say he means city-states, but nobody’s calling Illyria a Greek Polis, and they get the same treatment. So are we saying the nations of Greece and Italy? or the city-sates of Athens and Sparta? Because it doesn’t make sense to say the anything of Athens and Italy.

        » At the same time the Romans became masters of Africa, and of such portions of Spain as they won from the Carthaginians. Both the Greeks and the Macedonians, and the nations of Asia who dwelt on the hither side of the river Kizil-Irmak and the Taurus, took part in these struggles with the Carthaginians: » Again, why ‘Macedonians and Greeks’? Greek is a nationality, its not «Athenian» so isn’t Macedonian another nationality? We don’t say Athenians and Greeks.
        «There remains to be described that part of Europe included between the Danube and the sea which surrounds it, beginning from the inner recess of the Adriatic, and extending to the Sacred mouth of the Danube. This part contains Greece, Macedonia, Epirus, and the people who live above them, extending to the Danube and to the two seas (the Adriatic and the Euxine Sea) on each side. On the Adriatic are the Illyrians; on the Euxine Sea, as far as the Propontis and Hellespont, are the Thracians, and the Scythian or Keltic tribes intermixed with them. We must begin from the Danube, and treat of the countries which follow next in order to those already described, that is to say, the parts contiguous to Italy, the Alps, the Germans, the Dacians, and the Getæ.» Again, not say Phocis, Thessaly, Macedonia etc, but Greece, Macedonia, Epirus, Illyria, Thrace, Scythia… Nations, not city-states?
        » People formerly very powerful are extinct, or were reduced to the lowest condition, as the Boii and Scordisci among the Galatæ; the Autariatæ, Ardiæi, and Dardanii, among the Illyrians; and the Triballi among the Thracians. They first declined in consequence of disputes amongst themselves, but were finally prostrated by wars with the Macedonians and Romans.» Same issue here.
        «These are the nations, bounded by the Danube and by the Illyrian and Thracian mountains, which are worthy of record. They occupy the whole coast of the Adriatic Sea, beginning from the recess of the gulf, and the left side, as it is called, of the Euxine Sea, from the river Danube to Byzantium.
        The southern parts of the above-mentioned mountainous tract, and the countries which follow, lying below it, remain to be described. Among these are Greece, and the contiguous barbarous country extending to the mountains» I thought Greece extended to the mountains? My dad fought insurgents at Vitsi.
        » The country, from the commencement of the Macedonian and Pæonian mountains, as far as the river Strymon, is inhabited by Macedonians, and Pæones, and some of the Thracian mountain tribes. But all the country on the other side the Strymon, as far as the mouth of the Euxine Sea, and Mount Hæmus, belong to the Thracians, except the coast, which is occupied by Greeks, some of whom are settled on the Propontis, others on the Hellespont and on the Gulf Melas, and others on the Ægean Sea.» Again Greeks vs Macedonians, Thracians, etc. Clearly there are Greek colonies on the coast like Amphipolis, but the majority of the inland population is something else. Also, Athens NEVER made a colony on the shores of Argos or Corinth Sparta Mesenne Thessaly but they made Olynthus Amphipolis and dozens more on the coasts of Macedonia Epirus and Thrace. hm. weird.

        » Some say that, in the language of the Molotti and Thesprotæ, old women are called “peliæ,” and old men “pelii,” …. Among the Thesprotæ and Molotti old women are called “peliæ,” and old men “pelii,” as among the Macedonians. Persons at least who hold office are called “peligones,” as among the Laconians and Massilienses they are called “gerontes.”» Huh, so much for the same language.

        » There are many Greek tribes, but the chief people are equal in number to the Greek dialects with which we are acquainted, namely, four. Of these, the Ionic is the same as the ancient Attic; (for Iones was the former name of the inhabitants of Attica; from thence came the Iones who settled in Asia, and use the dialect now called Ionic;) the Doric was the same as the Æolic dialect, for all the people on the other side of the isthmus except the Athenians, the Megareans, and the Dorians about Parnassus, are even now called Æolians; it is probable that the Dorians, from their being a small nation, and occupying a most rugged country, and from want of intercourse [with the Æolians], no longer resemble that people either in language or customs, and, although of the same race, have lost all appearance of affinity. It was the same with the Athenians, who inhabiting a rugged country with a light soil, escaped the ravages of invaders. As they always occupied the same territory, and no enemy attempted to expel them, nor had any desire to take possession of it themselves, on this account they were, according to Thucydides, regarded as Autochthones, or an indigenous race. This was probably the reason, although they were a small nation, why they remained a distinct people with a distinct dialect.
        It was not in the parts only on the other side of the isthmus, that the Æolian nation was powerful, but those on this side also were formerly Æolians. They were afterwards intermixed first with Ionians who came from Attica, and got possession of Ægialus, and secondly with Dorians, who under the conduct of the Heracleidæ founded Megara and many of the cities in the Peloponnesus. The Iones were soon expelled by the Achæi, an Æolian tribe; and there remained in Peloponnesus the two nations, the Æolic and the Doric. Those nations then that had little intercourse with the Dorians used the Æolian dialect. (This was the case with the Arcadians and Eleians, the former of whom were altogether a mountain tribe, and did not share in the partition of the Peloponnesus; the latter were considered as dedicated to the service of the Olympian Jupiter, and lived for a long period in peace, principally because they were of Æolian descent, and had admitted into their country the army of Oxylus, about the time of the return of the Heracleidæ.) The rest used a kind of dialect composed of both, some of them having more, others less, of the Æolic dialect. Even at present the inhabitants of different cities use different dialects, but all seem to Dorize, or use the Doric dialect, on account of the ascendency of that nation. Such then is the number of the Grecian nations» Ok, where are the Macedonians Thracians and Epirotes?
        » Trœzen is sacred to Neptune, from whom it was formerly called Poseidonia. It is situated 15 stadia from the sea. Nor is this an obscure city. In front of its harbour, called Pogon, lies Calauria, a small island, of about 30 stadia in compass. Here was a temple of Neptune, which served as an asylum for fugitives. It is said that this god exchanged Delos for Calauria with Latona, and Tænarum for Pytho with Apollo. Ephorus mentions the oracle respecting it:
        “It is the same thing to possess Delos, or Calauria,
        The divine Pytho, or the windy Tænarum.”
        There was a sort of Amphictyonic body to whom the concerns of this temple belonged, consisting of seven cities, which performed sacrifices in common. These were Hermon, Epidaurus, Ægina, Athenæ, Prasiæ, Nauplia, and Orchomenus Minyeius. The Argives contributed in behalf of Nauplia, and the Lacedæmonians in behalf of Prasiæ. The veneration for this god prevailed so strongly among the Greeks, that the Macedonians, even when masters of the country, nevertheless preserved even to the present time the privilege of the asylum, and were restrained by shame from dragging away the suppliants who took refuge at Calauria. Archias even, with a body of soldiers, did not dare to use force to Demosthenes, although he had received orders from Antipater to bring him alive, and all other orators he could find, who were accused of the same crimes. He attempted persuasion, but in vain, for Demosthenes deprived himself of life by taking poison in the temple.» So here is the full quote. The Macedonians are NOT among the amphictyony of states venerating this temple. They do respect the subjects religion, like the Romans with Zoroastrianism, but nowhere does it say they shared it.

        » Thebans, having vanquished the Lacedæmonians in two battles, disputed the sovereignty of Greece. Epaminondas, however, was killed, and they were disappointed in their hope of obtaining this supremacy. … Reduced by this war, and by the Macedonians, at the time they invaded Greece, they lost their city, which was afterwards restored to them, and rebuilt by the Macedonians themselves, who had razed it.» So when the Thebans fight other Geeks, it is a civil war, and attempting to seize sovereignty like a coup, but the Macedonians INVADE GREECE, FROM OUTSIDE.
        » such are the long tunics, which in tragedies are called Thessalian; they are fastened about the body with a girdle, and with a clasp on the shoulder. The tragedians, for they required some additional decoration of this kind, imitate the Thessalians in their attire. The Thessalians in particular, from wearing a long dress, (probably because they inhabit the most northerly and the coldest country in all Greece,) afforded the most appropriate subject of imitation to actors for their theatrical representations. » Again just like Herodotus, the Thessalians are the north-most of the Greeks. This is a problem.
        ******************************************************************

        PLUTARCH
        «Be that as it may, Alexander was born early in the month Hecatombaeon, the Macedonian name for which is Loüs, on the sixth day of the month, and on this day the temple of Ephesian Artemis was burnt. » So Macedonians had a different system for counting time and or language?
        » For it was neither every kind of fame nor fame from every source that he courted, as Philip did, who plumed himself like a sophist on the power of his oratory, and took care to have the victories of his chariots at Olympia engraved upon his coins; 10 nay, when those about him inquired whether he would be willing to contend in the foot-race at the Olympic games, since he was swift of foot, «Yes,» said he, «if I could have kings as my contestants.» And in general, too, Alexander appears to have been averse to the whole race of athletes» So according to Plutarch, the Olympics were not good enough for the prince. Did he actually try to compete?
        » Alexander, though only sixteen years of age… was also present at Chaeroneia and took part in the battle against the Greeks» This again. Not the other Greeks or the Thebans, Locrians….. the Greeks.
        » Then Philip rose up against him with drawn sword, but, fortunately for both, his anger and his wine made him trip and fall. Then Alexander, mocking over him, said: «Look now, men! here is one who was preparing to cross from Europe into Asia; and he is upset in trying to cross from couch to couch.» After this drunken broil Alexander took Olympias and established her in Epirus, while he himself tarried in Illyria.» Ok, even if Epirus was Greek, why does a Greek tarry in Illyria??
        «Thus it was that at the age of twenty years Alexander received the kingdom, which was exposed to great jealousies, dire hatreds, and dangers on every hand. For the neighboring tribes of Barbarians would not tolerate their servitude, and longed for their hereditary kingdoms; and as for Greece, although Philip had conquered her in the field, he had not had time enough to make her tame under his yoke, but had merely disturbed and changed the condition of affairs there, and then left them in a great surge and commotion, owing to the strangeness of the situation. The Macedonian counselors of Alexander had fears of the crisis, and thought he should give up the Greek states altogether and use no more compulsion there, and that he should call the revolting Barbarians back to their allegiance by mild measures and try to arrest the first symptoms of their revolutions» Where to start? Philip and Alexander did not ‘Unify’ Greece, they CONQUERED her, yoked her. Second, Alexander is urged to give up the Greek states, not the ‘Other’ Greek states.
        «…on learning that the Thebans had revolted and that the Athenians were in sympathy with them, he immediately led his forces through the pass of Thermopylae, declaring that since Demosthenes had called him a boy while he was among the Illyrians and Triballians, and a stripling when he had reached Thessaly, he wished to show him that before the walls of Athens he was a man.» As a boy he was in Illiria and Triballia. Hm.
        » But the Thebans made a counter-demand that he should surrender to them Philotas and Antipater, and made a counter-proclamation that all who wished to help in setting Greece free should range themselves with them.. and their city was taken, plundered, and razed to the ground. This was done, in the main, because Alexander expected that the Greeks would be terrified by so great a disaster and cower down in quiet» Well, nice dude. Also, again, the Greeks, not the other Greeks.
        » some Thracians broke into the house of Timocleia, a woman of high repute and chastity.. shamefully violated her.. And when the Thracians led her, with hands bound, to Alexander… and when the king asked her who she was, she replied that she was a sister of Theagenes, who drew up the forces which fought Philip in behalf of the liberty of the Greeks, and fell in command at Chaeroneia.» Again, the Greeks, not the other Greeks.
        » And now, wishing to consult the god concerning the expedition against Asia, he went to Delphi; and since he chanced to come on one of the inauspicious days, when it is not lawful to deliver oracles, in the first place he sent a summons to the prophetess. And when she refused to perform her office and cited the law in her excuse, he went up himself and tried to drag her to the temple….» Clearly he respects Hellenic religion a great deal. Bull.
        » Many rushed upon Alexander, for he was conspicuous by his buckler and by his helmet’s crest, on either side of which was fixed a plume of wonderful size and whiteness. » Greeks had horsehair crests, not big white plumes, afaik.
        » Thaïs, an Athenian… said… it would be a still greater pleasure to go in revel rout and set fire to the house of the Xerxes who burned Athens, she herself kindling the fire under the eyes of Alexander, in order that a tradition might prevail among men that the women in the train of Alexander inflicted a greater punishment upon the Persians in behalf of Hellas than all her famous commanders by sea and land. » Alexander is not counted among Hellas’s famous commanders. Hm.
        «However, he said, he allowed those who wished it to go away, calling them to witness that while he was winning the inhabited world for the Macedonians he had been left behind with his friends and those who were willing to continue the expedition. This is almost word for word what he wrote in his letter to Antipater, and….. he chose out thirty thousand boys and gave orders that they should learn the Greek language and be trained to use Macedonian weapons, appointing many instructors for this work…. Moreover, when he saw that among his chiefest friends Hephaestion approved his course and joined him in changing his mode of life, while Craterus clung fast to his native ways, he employed the former in his business with the Barbarians, the latter in that with the Greeks and Macedonians. » Oh, so it is the Greek language and Macedonian weapons, and he’s ‘winning the inhabited world for the Macedonians.’ not the Greeks. Interesting.
        » Alexander rode up and abused Hephaestion publicly, calling him a fool and a madman for not knowing that without Alexander’s favour he was nothing; and in private he also sharply reproved Craterus. Then he brought them together and reconciled them, taking an oath by Ammon and the rest of the gods that he loved them most of all men; but that if he heard of their quarreling again, he would kill them both» So he sacrifices to an Egyptian god too. Are we to think he’s Egyptian now?
        «Do not the Greeks appear to you to walk about among Macedonians like demi-gods among wild beasts?» … Then Alexander, no longer able to restrain his anger, threw one of the apples that lay on the table at Cleitus and hit him, and began looking about for his sword. But one of his body-guards, Aristophanes, conveyed it away before he could lay his hands on it, and the rest surrounded him and begged him to desist, whereupon he sprang to his feet and called out in Macedonian speech a summons to his corps of guards» So there’s Greek Language and Macedonian Speech???

        » Callisthenes … the sophist went about with lofty thoughts as if bent on abolishing a tyranny, and that the young men flocked to him and followed him… Alexander himself, in the letters which he wrote at once to Craterus, Attalus, and Alcetas, says that the youths confessed under torture that they had made this attempt of themselves, and that no one else was privy to it. But in a letter written later to Antipater, wherein he accuses Callisthenes also of the crime, he says: «The youths were stoned to death by the Macedonians, but the sophist I will punish, together with those who sent him to me and those who harbour in their cities men who conspire against my life;» » Since when did Greeks kill people by stoning???
        «While Demosthenes was still in exile, Alexander died in Babylon, and the Greek states combined yet again to form a league against Macedon. Demosthenes attached himself to the Athenian convoys, and threw all his energies into helping them incite the various states to attack the Macedonians and drive them out of Greece.» Not back into Macedonia… Out of Greece. Last I heard, you could drive pestilent Texans back into Texas, not out of the US.
        ******************************************************
        THUCYDIDES:
        » Perdiccas, son of Alexander, king of the Macedonians, had from an old friend and ally been made an enemy. He had been made an enemy by the Athenians entering into alliance with his brother Philip and Derdas, who were in league against him. In his alarm he had sent to Lacedaemon to try and involve the Athenians in a war with the Peloponnesians, and was endeavouring to win over Corinth in order to bring about the revolt of Potidaea.» Oh, how philhellenic of him.
        «Leaving these two towns to prepare together against the speedy arrival of the Athenians, Brasidas and Perdiccas started on a second joint expedition into Lyncus against Arrhabaeus; the latter with the forces of his Macedonian subjects, and a corps of heavy infantry composed of Hellenes domiciled in the country… . In all there were about three thousand Hellenic heavy infantry, accompanied by all the Macedonian cavalry.» Again. Macedonians and (not other) Hellenes. Hm
        **************************************************************
        PAUSANIAS:

        «It was Leosthenes who, at the head of
        the Athenians and all the Greeks, defeated the Macedonians in
        Boeotia and again outside Thermopylae ; and after overpowering
        them shut them up in Lamia, over against Oeta.» All the Greeks vs the Maconians. Hm.

        «For the disaster at Chaeronea was the beginning of evil to
        all the Greeks ; and the yoke of slavery which it brought with it
        pressed not least heavily on the states that had held aloof or had
        sided with Macedonia. Most of the cities Philip captured. With
        the Athenians he nominally made a treaty, but in reality he inflicted
        on them the deepest injuries of all, for he wrested islands from them
        and deposed them from the empire of the sea. For a time the
        Athenians kept quiet during the reign of Philip and afterwards of
        Alexander. But when Alexander died and the Macedonians chose
        Aridaeus king, though the whole government was vested in Anti-
        pater, the Athenians could no longer brook the thought that Greece
        should for ever be at the feet of Macedonia ; so they were bent on
        war and stirred up others to action. 4. The cities that joined them 4
        were these : in Peloponnese there were Argos, Epidaurus, Sicyon,
        Troezen, Elis, Phlius, Messene ; outside the Isthmus of Corinth
        there were the Locrians, Phocians, Thessalians, Carystians, and the
        Acarnanians who belonged to the Aetolian League…»

        » The name Gauls came into vogue late,
        for of old the people were called Celts both by themselves and others.
        A host of them mustered and marched towards the Ionian Sea :
        they dispossessed the Illyrian nation and the Macedonians, as well
        as all the intervening peoples, and overran Thessaly. When they
        were come near to Thermopylae most of the Greeks awaited» Thermopylae and Thessaly are places. Illyians, Macedonians and Greeks are ethnicities, apparently.

        «But the shields of the Macedonians
        he dedicated to Zeus at Dodona : they bear the inscription :

        These shields once laid waste the golden Asian land,
        These shields brought slavery upon the Greeks ;

        But now they hang ownerless on the pillars Aqueous Zeus,
        Spoils of the boastful Macedon.» Again, the Greeks, not the Other Greeks.

        «The Athenians replied that they would never join the
        Messenians in invading Laconia, but if the Lacedaemonians began
        the war and marched against Messenia, the Athenians promised to
        stand by the Messenians. At last the Messenians formed an alliance
        with Philip, son of Amyntas, and the Macedonians ; and they say it
        was this which prevented them from taking part in the battle of
        Chaeronea. But, on the other hand, they would not draw sword
        against Greece. When after the death of Alexander the Greeks took 3
        up arms against Macedonia for the second time, the Messenians
        shared in the war» So the Messenians would side with Athens against Sparta, an inter-Greek affair, but to fight alongside the Macedonians at Chaeronia would have been raising the sword AGAINST GREECE as a whole. Hm.

        «the native town of Pulydamas, is now
        no longer inhabited… it happened that they were holding a public assembly. So Alexander surrounded them with targeteers and archers, and shot them all down, and he butchered all the rest of the men, and sold
        the women and children in order to pay his mercenaries… The
        handful that escaped abode for a little while

        Μου αρέσει!

    • Chris, a pureblooded GREEK said

      in the city, but after- wards they too were obliged, by their weak and forlorn condition, to abandon it at the time when God visited the whole Greek nation with a second overthrow in the war with Macedonia» Enough said.

      » the Achaeans deeply resented the
      conduct of Flamininus… They foresaw also that, like the rest of
      Greece, they were only about to exchange the dominion of Macedonia for that of Rome.» Macedonians, Romans. Potato Potaho.

      «For in a battle with the Romans, under Flamininus, on the
      heights called Cynoscephalae, Philip … was so
      soundly beaten that he lost most of his army, and had to enter into
      an engagement with the Romans, in virtue of which he withdrew
      his garrisons from every Greek city which he had reduced by force
      of arms.» Enough said.

      «Cassander, son of
      Antipater…hunted to death the whole house of Alexander : he flung
      Olympias to the infuriated Macedonians to be stoned by them to
      death; and he poisoned Alexander’s sons, Hercules whom Alexander
      had by Barsina, and Alexander whom he had by Roxana» Again with the stoning. This is dysfunctional for Greek royal politics.

      » About fifteen
      furlongs to the right of the city is the sanctuary of Ptoan Apollo.
      The poet Asius says that Ptous, after whom Apollo and the
      mountain were named, was a son of Athamas and Themisto.
      Before the invasion of the Macedonians under Alexander and the
      destruction of Thebes there was an infallible oracle here.» Alexander so respects the Greek religion that he destroyed an oracle of Apollo. Hm. Looting temples was extremely rare in Greek civil war. Oracles? unheard of afaik.

      » Brennus and Acichorius commanded the army destined to attack Paeonia while Bolgius marched against the Macedonians and Illyrians, and
      engaged in conflict with Ptolemy, then king of Macedonia…. Ptolemy himself fell in the battle, and the Macedonian loss was heavy ; but again the Celts had not the courage to march against Greece, and so the
      second expedition returned home again.» Celts invade Macedonia, not a part of Greece, apparently. Unfortunately they did end up invading Greece and apparently ATE their victims.

      » The spirit of the Greeks had fallen very low, but the very
      excess of their fear roused them to the necessity of defending
      Greece… safety was not to be had by a gift of water and earth ; for the fate that had over- taken the Macedonians, Thracians, and Paeonians in the former inroad of the Gauls was still fresh in their memory… Death or victory, that was the alternative that every man and every state prepared to face. » Greeks apparently doesn’t include Macedonians, Thracians, and Paeonians.

      ******************************************************************
      ARRIAN of NICOMEDIA:

      «Then indeed the Thebans, no longer defending
      themselves, were slain… in their
      houses, having there turned to defend themselves from
      the enemy, and others were slain as they were supplicating
      the protection of the gods in the temples ; not
      even the women and children being spared.» Alexander sure respected Greek religious sanctity….

      «.. the complete enslavement
      of Thebes… was attributed not without probability to the avenging wrath
      of the deity. It seemed as if the Thebans had after a long time suffered this punishment for their betrayal of the Greeks in the Median war» Those Greeks who side with Persians against Leonidas and Themistocles are denounced as traitors by Arrian. Those Greeks who side with Persians against Alexander are just mercenaries as below…. Hm.

      » Having settled these affairs, he returned into Macedonia.
      He then offered to the Olympian Zeus the sacrifice which
      had been instituted by Archelaus and had been customary
      up to that time; and he celebrated the public
      contest of the Olympic games at Aegae.^ » So sacrifice to Zeus not practiced in Macedonia before Alexander’s grand-dad, a known «philhellene», and isnt that funny. Byron was a Philhellene, Kolokotronis a Patriot….
      Also, why isn’t Alexander celebrating in Olympia?

      » At the beginning of the spring he marched
      towards the Hellespont, entrusting the affairs of Macedonia
      and Greece to Antipater. He led not much above 30,000 infantry together with light-armed troops and archers, and more than 5,000 cavalry.^ »

      » Besides, he did not wish to
      deliver over to the foreigners on so unstable an element
      the advantage which the Macedonians derived from their
      skill and courage; and if they were beaten in the seabattle,
      their defeat would be no small hindrance to their
      final success in the war, both for other reasons, and
      especially because the Greeks, being animated with
      courage at the news of his naval defeat, would attempt to
      effect a revolution. …. Then the Macedonians from all
      sides pressed close upon the citizens and the Grecian
      mercenaries, who took to flight ; some of them, casting
      themselves into the sea»

      » Alexander … led out the Macedonians and slew those who
      were still engaged in setting fire to the city. But
      he issued orders to preserve all the Halicarnassians who
      should be taken in their houses. As soon as the daylight
      appeared he could discern the strongholds which
      the Persians and the Grecian mercenaries had occupied;
      but he decided not to besiege them, considering that he »

      » Some of the Macedonians who served in Alexander’s
      army had married … and therefore sent them back from Caria
      to spend the winter in Macedonia with their wives…
      He gave these officers instructions to levy as many horse
      and foot soldiers as they could from the country… He also sent Cleander, son of Polemocrates, to levy soldiers in Peloponnesus, and Parmenio to
      Sardis, giving him the command of a regiment of the
      Cavalry Companions, the Thessalian cavalry, and the rest
      of the Grecian allies» Volunteer army? More like a blood tax

      » Here an embassy reached Alexander from the
      Athenians, beseeching him to release to them the Athenian
      prisoners who … were then in
      Macedonia serving in chains …. The envoys departed
      without obtaining their request on behalf of the prisoners
      for the present. For Alexander did not think it safe,
      whilst the war against the Persian was still going on, to
      relax in the slightest degree the terror with which he
      inspired the Greeks» So Philhellenic

      » But as soon as Darius was certified of Alexander’s
      approach for battle, he conveyed about 30,000 of his
      cavalry and with them 20,000 of his light-armed infantry
      across the river Pinarus, in order that he might be able
      to draw up the rest of his forces with ease. Of the heavy
      armed infantry, he placed first the 30,000 Greek mercenaries
      to oppose the phalanx of the Macedonians, and
      on both sides of these he placed 60,000 of the men called
      Cardaces, who were also heavy-armed infantry………………..
      ……………………………………..
      and here Alexanderand his men won a brilliant victory. … Here then the struggle was
      desperate ; the aim of the Greek mercenaries of Darius
      being to push the Macedonians back into the river, and
      regain the victory, though their own forces were already
      flying; the aim of the Macedonians being not to fall
      short of Alexander’s good-fortune, which was already
      manifest, and not to tarnish the glory of the phalanx,
      which up to that time had been commonly asserted to be
      invincible. Moreover the feeling of rivalry which existed
      between the Grecian and Macedonian races inspired each
      side in the conflict. Hereupon the regiments on the right wing, perceiving
      that the Persians opposed to them had already been put
      to rout, wheeled round towards the Grecian mercenaries
      of Darius and their own hard-pressed detachment. Having
      driven the Greeks away from the river, they extended
      their phalanx beyond the Persian army on the side which
      had been broken ; and attacking the Greeks on the flank,
      were already beginning to cut them up. However the
      Persian cavalry which had been posted opposite the
      Thessalians did not remain on the other side of the river –
      during the struggle, but came through the water and
      made a vigorous attack upon the Thessalian squadrons…. for the Persians
      did not give way until they perceived that Darius
      had fled and the Grecian mercenaries had been cut up by
      the phalanx and severed from them. »

      » Alexander said that he wished to take vengeance on the Persians,
      in retaliation for their deeds in the invasion of Greece,
      when they razed Athens to the ground and burnt down
      the temples. But
      Alexander does not seem to me to have acted on this
      occasion with prudence j nor do I think that this was
      any retributive penalty at all on the ancient Persians.» Arrian doesn’t believe Alexander’s excuse. Seeing how Alexander liked to terrorize Greece, how can we disagree?

      » When Alexander reached ecbatana, he sent the Thessalian
      cavalry and the other Grecian allies back to the
      sea,» Oh, so when its the Thesallians it’s them and THE OTHER GREEKS, but when it’s the Macedonian, it’s the and THE GREEKS. Ta efkolos enoumena???

      » Such was the end of Darius, in the archonship of Aristophon
      at Athens, in the month Hecatombaion. This king was .. involved in a war with the Macedonians and Greeks at the very time he succeeded
      to the regal power and consequently it was no longer
      possible for him to act the tyrant towards his subjects
      even if he had been so inclined, standing as he did in
      greater danger than they.»

      » Alexander was induced to indulge his
      desire of emulating the Median and Persian wealth and
      to treat his subjects as inferior beings according to the
      custom of the foreign kings. Nor do I by any means
      commend him for changing the Macedonian style of dress
      which his fathers had adopted, for the Median one,»
      Not «our style of dress», the «macedonian» one

      » As Clitus did not desist from his insulting remarks,
      Alexander …snatched a javelin from one of his confidential bodyguards
      … with which he struck Clitus and killed him.» No Spartan king would stoop to that level.

      » Anaxarchus commenced the discussion by saying that
      he considered Alexander much more worthy of being
      deemed a god than either Dionysus or Heracles, not only
      on account of the very numerous and mighty exploits which he had performed but also because Dionysus was only a Theban, in no way related to Macedonians ; and
      Heracles was an Argive, not at all related to them,
      except that Alexander deduced his descent from him.
      He added that the Macedonians might with greater justice
      gratify their king with divine honors,» So much for respecting Greek divinities. Also even if Alexander CLAIMED Argive Descent (And Hitler Greek, so? Actions… Actions), the Macedonians feel no kinship. Also, which Greeks in that century deified Kings? Nobody. God Leonidas anyone??

      » But Callisthenes
      interposed and said… I demand, Alexander… make
      up thy mind whether thou wilt return thither and compel
      the Greeks, who are men most devoted to freedom, to pay
      .
      thee the honor of prostration, or whether thou wilt keep
      aloof from Greece, and inflict this honor on the Macedonians
      alone» Greeks (in all poleis) are freedom-loving. Macedonians arent. Enough said.

      «These reports excited
      in Alexander an ardent desire to advance farther ;
      but the spirit of the Macedonians now began to flag… he called a
      council of the officers of the brigades and addressed
      them as follows :
      » … if as the result of these labours,
      you hold possession of Ionia, the Hellespont… the Phrygias, Cappadocia, Patagonia, Lydia, Caria, Lycia,Pamphylia, Phoenicia, Egypt together with Greek part of Libya….. why do ye shrink from adding the Hyphasis also, and the nations beyond this river, to the Macedonian empire?…… But what great or glorious deed could we have performed,
      if, sitting at ease in Macedonia, we had thought it
      sufficient to preserve our own country without any labour,
      simply repelling the attacks of the nations on our frontiers,
      the Thracians, Illyrians, and Triballians, or even
      those Greeks who were unfriendly to our interests ?» Macedonian empire. Apparently taking away from Greece the Greek part of Libya. Enough said. Greeks Illyrians and Tribalians are clearly races/nations and potential enemies to Macedonians. Are we supposed to somehow think at the same time Macedonians and Thracians are part of the Greeks?? Its Greeks again, not ‘other Greeks’ or our fellow Greeks/kinsmen in Sparta and Argos etc, a term that litters Thucydides Herodotus Plutarch etc in inter-city-state dialogue, even in the midst of bitter civil war. Oh yeah, Macedonians do not consider Argives kin…

      **********************************************************************

      DEMOSTHENES:

      » and when I find the same man using very different language about this plunderer of the Greeks, who is extending his power, as you see, at our very doors and in the heart of Greece, I am astonished, and, whoever he may be, it is I that fear him, just because he does not fear Philip. » Phillip the plunderer of the Greeks. Not the Ionians or the Dorians etc. The Greeks. A nation not a rabble of warring poleis.

      » But Philip, … has robbed the Pheraeans of their city… he is even now engaged in an expedition against Ambracia, and as for the three Elean colonies in Cassopia—Pandosia, Bucheta, and Elatea—he has wasted their land with fire, stormed their cities, and handed them over to be the slaves of his own kinsman, Alexander. How zealous he is for the freedom and independence of the Greeks, you may judge from his acts. » Enough said.

      » what has become manifest to all living men alike is this—that, in effect, the freedom of the whole Greek world was being preserved in the souls of these men. At any rate, since fate removed them, not one of those remaining has made a stand against the foe. While I desire that my words may be free from offence, it seems to me that if one should declare that the valor of these men was the very life of Greece he would speak the truth; for at one and the same time their spirits were separated from their dear bodies and the self-esteem of Greece was taken from her.» Funeral Oration at Chaeronea for those who died fighting Phillip. No orator ever declared all Greece enslaved and defiled when Athens Sparta or Thebes were running Greece despite the fury of those wars. If anyone has sources where they do, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE provide them

      » Olympias has made complaints against you about the incident at Dodona, complaints which are unfair, as I have twice already proved in the Assembly before yourselves and the rest of Athens. I explained to her envoys that the charges she brings against the city are not justified. For Zeus of Dodona commanded you through the oracle to embellish the statue of Dione. You made a face as beautiful as you could, together with all the other appropriate parts; and having prepared a great deal of expensive finery for the goddess and dispatched envoys with a sacrifice at great expense, you embellished the statue of Dione in a manner worthy of yourselves and of the goddess. These measures brought you the complaints of Olympias, who said in her letters that the country of Molossia, in which the temple stands, belonged to her, and that therefore we had no right to interfere with anything there at all. » Epirote? Mollosian? Olympias has such respect for Greek religious practice. How very Greek of her.

      » Not content with the destruction of cities, is he not organizing the Pythian games, the common festival of the Greeks, and if he cannot be present in person, sending his menials to act as stewards? Is he not master of Thermopylae and the passes into Greece, holding those places with his garrisons and his mercenaries? Has he not the right of precedence at the Oracle, ousting us and the Thessalians and the Dorians and the rest of the Amphictyons from a privilege which not even all Greek states can claim? Does he not dictate to the Thessalians their form of government? Does he not send mercenaries, some to Porthmus to expel the Eretrian democracy, others to Oreus to set up the tyranny of Philistides? Yet the Greeks see all this and suffer it. They seem to watch him just as they would watch a hailstorm, each praying that it may not come their way, but none making any effort to stay its course. And it is not only his outrages on Greece that go unavenged, but even the wrongs which each suffers separately. For nothing can go beyond that. Are not the Corinthians hit by his invasion of Ambracia and Leucas? The Achaeans by his vow to transfer Naupactus to the Aetolians? The Thebans by his theft of Echinus? And is he not marching even now against his allies the Byzantines? Of our own possessions, not to mention other places, is he not holding Cardia, the greatest city in the Chersonese? In spite of such treatment, we hesitate one and all, we play the coward, we keep an eye on our neighbors, distrusting one another rather than our common foe. Yet if he treats us all with such brutality, what do you think he will do when he has got each of us separately into his clutches?» If Phillip is Greek, why him organizing the Pythian Games and forcing his way into the Amphictyony via sacred war (like later some Roman states did too) MORE an insult to Greece than destroying her cities? AFAIK no Greek ever declared what any of Athens Sparta or Thebes did to other Greeks an «Outrage on Greece» as a nation DID THEY???

      » Philip, they say, after all is not yet what the Lacedaemonians were; they were masters of every sea and land » There is a theme here. Philip vs the Spartans. Not the Macedonians vs the Spartans, not Phillip vs Lysander. Demostheneses Greeks are citizens of poleis, Philip is a tribal monarch. Arrian earlier always calls Macedonians ‘Son of …» and (other????? does this still make sense) Greeks «so and so of Orchomenos» say. A significant social difference. Greeks are citizens, Macedonians tribal. Demosthenes talks the same.

      » To begin with ourselves, we must make provision for our defense, I mean with war-galleys, funds, and men; for even if all other states succumb to slavery, we surely must fight the battle of liberty. Then having completed all these preparations and made our purpose clear, … we must summon, collect, instruct, and exhort the rest of the Greeks… » Not the allies of Athens like in the civil wars, the REST OF THE GREEKS like when the Persians invaded.

      «I observe, however, that all men, and you first of all, have conceded to Philip something which has been the occasion of every war that the Greeks have ever waged. And what is that? The power of doing what he likes, of calmly plundering and stripping the Greeks one by one, and of attacking their cities and reducing them to slavery. Yet your hegemony in Greece lasted seventy-five years, that of Sparta twenty-nine, and in these later times Thebes too gained some sort of authority after the battle of Leuctra. But neither to you nor to the Thebans nor to the Lacedaemonians did the Greeks ever yet, men of Athens, concede the right of unrestricted action, or anything like it. On the contrary, when you, or rather the Athenians of that day, were thought to be showing a want of consideration in dealing with others, all felt it their duty, even those who had no grievance against them, to go to war in support of those who had been injured; and again, when the Lacedaemonians had risen to power and succeeded to your position of supremacy, and when they set to work to encroach on others and interfered unduly with the established order of things, all the Greeks were up in arms, even those who had no grievance of their own. Why need I refer to the other states? Nay, we ourselves and the Lacedaemonians, though at the outset we could not have specified any wrong at each other’s hands, thought it our duty to fight on account of wrongs which we saw the other states suffering. Yet all the faults committed by the Lacedaemonians in those thirty years, and by our ancestors in their seventy years of supremacy, are fewer, men of Athens, than the wrongs which Philip has done to the Greeks in the thirteen incomplete years in which he has been coming to the top—or rather, they are not a fraction of them. And this is easily proved by a short calculation. I pass over Olynthus and Methone and Apollonia and the two and thirty cities in or near Thrace, all of which Philip has destroyed so ruthlessly that a traveler would find it hard to say whether they had ever been inhabited. I say nothing of the destruction of the important nation of the Phocians. But how stands the case of the Thessalians? Has he not robbed them of their free constitutions and of their very cities, setting up tetrarchies in order to enslave them, not city by city, but tribe by tribe? Are not tyrannies already established in Euboea, an island, remember, not far from Thebes and Athens? Does he not write explicitly in his letters, “I am at peace with those who are willing to obey me”? And he does not merely write this without putting it into practice; but he is off to the Hellespont, just as before he hurried to Ambracia; in the Peloponnese he occupies the important city of Elis; only the other day he intrigued against the Megarians. Neither the Greek nor the barbarian world is big enough for the fellow’s ambition. And we Greeks see and hear all this, and yet we do not send embassies to one another and express our indignation. We are in such a miserable position, we have so entrenched ourselves in our different cities, that to this very day we can do nothing that our interest or our duty demands; we cannot combine, we cannot take any common pledge of help or friendship; but we idly watch the growing power of this man, each bent on profiting by the interval afforded by another’s ruin, taking not a thought, making not an effort for the salvation of Greece. For that Philip, like the recurrence or attack of a fever or some other disease, is threatening even those who think themselves out of reach, of that not one of you is ignorant. Ay, and you know this also, that the wrongs which the Greeks suffered from the Lacedaemonians or from us, they suffered at all events at the hands of true-born sons of Greece, and they might have been regarded as the acts of a legitimate son, born to great possessions, who should be guilty of some fault or error in the management of his estate: so far he would deserve blame and reproach, yet it could not be said that it was not one of the blood, not the lawful heir who was acting thus. But if some slave or superstitious bastard had wasted and squandered what he had no right to, heavens! how much more monstrous and exasperating all would have called it! Yet they have no such qualms about Philip and his present conduct, though he is not only no Greek, nor related to the Greeks, but not even a barbarian from any place that can be named with honor, but a pestilent knave from Macedonia, whence it was never yet possible to buy a decent slave. »

      The Spartans Athenians Thebans held HEGEMONY IN GREECE, even wronged other Greeks, but Philip committed OUTRAGES ON GREECE, not bunches of Greeks, but rather Greece herself. Also, Philip is savage by Greek standards of war «all of which Philip has destroyed so ruthlessly that a traveler would find it hard to say whether they had ever been inhabited» and he expects complete submission in a very unGreek way. And finally » Philip … is not only no Greek, nor related to the Greeks, but not even a barbarian from any place that can be named with honor, but a pestilent knave from Macedonia, whence it was never yet possible to buy a decent slave. »
      Cleary not all Greeks bought the Macedonian tyrants claims to Greek descent

      ===============================================================
      ISOCRATES:

      » and that, besides, you, beyond any of the Hellenes, were possessed of both wealth and power, which are the only things in the world that are adapted at once to persuade and to compel » Letter to Philip. He beyond any of the Greeks

      «But I must not shrink from telling you plainly of the discouragements I met with from some of my associates … “Think of it!” they said. “You are about to send an address which is intended to offer advice to Philip, a man who… has about him the ablest men in Macedonia, who, however inexperienced they may be in other matters, are likely to know better than you do what is expedient for him. Furthermore, you will find that there are many Hellenes living in his country, who are not unknown to fame or lacking in intelligence» If Macedonia is Greek, this is like saying we have a many Americans living in New York. We could say Texans in New York or Phocians in Athens or Greeks in America, but if one is nationality there other has to be too.

      » And the founder of your empire, although he aspired higher than did his fellow citizens and set his heart on a king’s power, was not minded to take the same road as others who set out to attain a like ambition. [107] For they endeavored to win this honor by engendering factions, disorder, and bloodshed in their own cities; he, on the other hand, held entirely aloof from Hellenic territory, and set his heart upon occupying the throne of Macedon. For he knew full well that the Hellenes were not accustomed to submit to the rule of one man, while the other races were incapable of ordering their lives without the control of some such power. And so it came about, owing to his unique insight in this regard, that his kingship has proved to be quite set apart from that of the generality of kings: for, because he alone among the Hellenes did not claim the right to rule over a people of kindred race, he alone was able to escape the perils incident to one-man power. For history discovers to us the fact that those among the Hellenes who have managed to acquire such authority have not only been destroyed themselves but have been blotted, root and branch, from the face of the earth; while he, on the contrary, lived a long and happy life and left his seed in possession of the same honors which he himself had enjoyed. » While Isocrates clearly likes Philip and is willing to run with the Argive descent claim (while trying to get the Athenians to submit to Philips rule but oh well he’s distantly descended from Argive royalty so that’s okay and generations of the Macedonians but lets not talk about it), Macedonians are not Greeks.

      *****************************************************************

      THRASYMACHUS (fragment, On Behalf of the Lariasaeans invaded by Macedonia)

      «Shall we being Greeks, be slaves to Archelaus, a barbarian?»

      *******************************************************************

      POLYBIUS:

      «My reason for writing about this war at such length, was the advisability, or rather necessity, in view of the general purpose of my history, of making clear the relations existing between Macedonia and Greece at a time which coincides with the period of which I am about to treat» Enough said.
      » After finishing the celebration of the Nemean games,
      King Philip of Macedon returned to Argos and laid aside his crown and purple robe, with the view of making a display of democratic equality and good nature. But the more democratic the dress which he wore, the more absolute and royal were the privileges which he claimed. He was not now content with seducing unmarried women, or even with intriguing with married women, but assumed the right of sending authoritatively for any woman whose appearance struck him; and offered violence to those who did not at once obey» How civilized.
      » the speech made by Agelaus of Naupactus in the first … “…O King. You will do this, if you abandon the policy of weakening the Greeks, and thus rendering them an easy prey to the invader; and consult on the contrary for their good as you would for your own person, and have a care for all parts of Greece alike, as if part and parcel of your own domains. If you act in this spirit, the Greeks will be your warm friends and faithful coadjutors in all your undertakings; while foreigners will be less ready to form designs against you, seeing with dismay the firm loyalty of the Greeks» Greece isnt part of Philips domains but if he treated her like instead of attacking her, much better all round. Again Greece, not the rest of Greece.

      » Flamininus nevertheless bade him speak on the matters he had come to consider. Philip however said that “The word was not with himself but with Flamininus; and therefore begged that he would state clearly what he was to do in order to have peace.” The Roman consul replied that “What he had to say was simple and obvious: it was to bid him evacuate Greece entirely of his men; restore the prisoners and deserters in his hands to

      Μου αρέσει!

      • Chris, a pureblooded GREEK said

        their several states, hand over to the Romans those parts of Illyricum of which he had become possessed since the peace of Epirus; and, similarly, to restore to Ptolemy all the cities which he had taken from him since the death of Ptolemy Philopator.
        Having said this Flamininus refrained from any further speech of his own; but turning to the others he bade them deliver what they had been severally charged to say by those who sent them. And first Dionysodorus, the envoy of Attalus, took up the discourse by declaring that “Philip ought to restore the king’s ships which had been captured in the battle at Chios and their crews with them; and to restore also the temple of Aphrodite to its original state, as well as the Nicephorium, both of which he had destroyed.” He was followed by the Rhodian navarch Acesimbrotus, who demanded “That Philip should evacuate Peraea, which he had taken from them; withdraw his garrisons from Iasus, Bargylia, and Euromus; restore the Perinthians to their political union with Byzantium; and evacuate Sestos, Abydos, and all commercial ports and harbours in Asia.” Following the Rhodians the Achaeans demanded “The restoration of Corinth and Argos uninjured.” Then came the Aetolians, who first demanded, like the Romans, that “Philip should entirely evacuate Greece; and, secondly, that he should restore to them uninjured all cities formerly members of the Aetolian league.”» Aside from the fact that yet another Philip is doing havoc in Greece AGAIN, he cannot very well entirely evacuate Greece of his troops if Macedonia is in Greece. ‘evacuate the other poleis’, yes, ‘evacuate Greece’, no.

        » For at the time when Onomarchus and Philomelus, in defiance of religion and law seized Delphi and made themselves masters of the treasury of the god, who is there among you who does not know that they collected such a mighty force as no Greek dared any longer face? Nay, along with this violation of religion, they were within an ace of becoming lords of all Greece also. At that crisis Philip volunteered his assistance; destroyed the tyrants, secured the temple » And inserted himself into the Ampictyony by hook or crook. ‘No Greek dared’. Philip did. Ta Efkolos….
        » That the Macedonian supremacy, men of Sparta, was the beginning of slavery to the Greeks, I am persuaded that no one will venture to deny; and you may satisfy yourselves by looking at it thus. There was a league of Greeks living in the parts towards Thrace who were colonists from Athens and Chalcis, of which the most conspicuous and powerful was the city of Olynthus. Having enslaved and made an example of this town, Philip not only became master of the Thraceward cities, but reduced Thessaly also to his authority by the terror which he had thus set up. Not long after this he conquered the Athenians in a pitched battle, and used his success with magnanimity, not from any wish to benefit the Athenians—far from it, but in order that his favourable treatment of them might induce the other states to submit to him voluntarily. The reputation of your city was still such that it seemed likely, that, if a proper opportunity arose, it would recover its supremacy in Greece. Accordingly, without waiting for any but the slightest pretext, Philip came with his army and cut down everything standing in your fields, and destroyed the houses with fire. And at last, after destroying towns and open country alike, he assigned part of your territory to the Argives, part to Tegea and Megalopolis, and part to the Messenians: determined to benefit every people in spite of all justice, on the sole condition of their injuring you. Alexander succeeded Philip on the throne, and how he destroyed Thebes, because he thought that it contained a spark of Hellenic life, however small, you all I think know well. And why need I speak in detail of how the successors of this king have treated the Greeks? For surely there is no man living, so uninterested in public affairs, as not to have heard how Antipater in his victory at Lamia treated the unhappy Athenians, as well as the other Greeks and how he went so far in violence and brutality as to institute man-hunters, and send them to the various cities to catch all who had ever spoken against, or in any way annoyed, the royal family of Macedonia: of whom some were dragged by force from the temples, and others from the very altars, and put to death with torture, and others who escaped were forced to leave Greece entirely; nor had they any refuge save the Aetolian nation alone. For the Aetolians were the only people in Greece who withstood Antipater in behalf of those unjustly defrauded of safety to their lives: they alone faced the invasion of Brennus and his barbarian army and they alone came to your aid when called upon, with a determination to assist you in regaining your ancestral supremacy in Greece» Never mind how we have all Greece again, not the rest of Greece. This is a level no polis of Greece ever stooped to or for so long.

        **********************************************
        some non-Greek ancient sources also
        **********************************************
        QUINTUS CURTIUS RUFUS
        » It was unanimously agreed, that Philotas should be forced by torture to expose his confederates. Dismissing, the king enjoined, all the council to secrecy. He gave public orders for the army to decamp the next day, as though that had been the subject of deliberation. He invited Philotas to the last banquet of which he was to partake, and had the heart not only to sup, but to converse familiarly with the man whom he had condemned…. By order, Philotas was then brought forth, with his hands pinioned at his back, and an old veil over his face. The soldiers were perceptibly moved at his deplorable appearance…. The king, turning to him, said: «The Macedonians are to be your judges. I ask, whether you intend to use their native language?» Philotas answered: «Besides the Macedonians, there are great numbers present, who I believe will understand me more readily, if I use the same language in which yourself spoke, for no other reason, I apprehend, than that it was more intelligible to the majority.» ‘Mark,’ cries the king, how Philotas rejects his country’s lanuage, disdained only by himself. But let him adopt ‘what tongue he pleases, so you remember that ‘he equally abhors our manners and our speech.’ And thus Alexander retired…. Alexander, returning into the council of the army, adjourned it to the next day, either that Philotas might be racked in prison, or that all the circumstances might be otherwise penetrated. Although night was approaching, the king convened his friends. Most of them proposed, that Philotas should be stoned to death, according to the Macedonian custom: but Hephaestion, Craterus, and Coenos, contended, that the truth ought to be wrung from him by torture and the others came over to their opinion. » By this point there are at least as many Greeks in Alexander’s army as his own. Macedonian language, not Greek, though bilingual, the later they disdain. Macedonian (barbaric) customs not Greek. good for us

        » Alexander….. began to concert in what manner he should take upon him celestial honours. Not satisfied to be styled, he was desirous that man- kind should believe that he was Jupiter’s son; as though he had the same authority over their minds, as over their tongues. He required the Macedonians, therefore, to salute him as worshippers, prostrating themselves on the ground, in the manner of the Persians. To stimulate his prurient pride, adulation was not wanting, the perpetual bane of kings, which ruins more than the fiercest hostility. The Macedonians are to be exculpated, for none of them could endure to swerve from their national customs: but the Greeks in the king’s train, sullied the profession of the liberal arts by corrupt manners…. Hercules and Bacchus, with Castor and Pollux, would give way to the new deity. On a festival, the king, therefore, had a banquet prepared with every gorgeous display: to which were invited the chief of his friends, Macedonians and Greeks, with his nobles.» Again, Greeks and Macedonians: different people with different customs….

        » said the king to the assembly … I know why thou wiliest me to introduce thy Callisthenes…. in order that he might here repeat the same scandalous things which thou, having fresh learned, hast been reciting before this assembly. Had he been a Macedonian, the worthy tutor had been brought in with his pupil: but an Olynthian is excluded from the privilege. After this speech, Alexander dismissed the council; and caused the condemned to be delivered to the other members of the band, who, to prove their allegiance, inflicted on the criminals a cruelly protracted execution. Callisthenes also died under torture: He was innocent of the conspiracy; but he was not fitted, for a court, by the disposition of a flatterer. No homicide excited in the Greeks stronger disaffection toward Alexander, inasmuch as Callisthenes possessed the highest probity and learning; by him, Alexander was reconciled to life, when, having slain Clitus, he would have destroyed himself by abstinence. The king did not simply kill the philosopher without a trial, but tortured him. His cruelty was succeeded too late by penitence.» Not only is Alexander a cruel tyrant but under him a Macedonian could speak in his own defense (for all the help it was to Philotas). A Greek however respected could not even testify at his own trial. Now are we to say Macedonians considered themselves Greek????
        » Among the company, was Dioxippus the Athenian, … Corrhagus, a Macedonian, already inebriated, concluded similar scurrilities with a challenge: «If thou «be a man, fight me tomorrow with the sword… On the following day, each more eagerly demanding the trial, the king, because he could not deter them, suffered the appointed meeting. An imposing concourse of the military were spectators; including the Greeks, who took part with Dioxippus. The Macedonian had taken the regular arms; holding with his left hand a brazen shield and the pike called sarissa… Dioxippus, by a close embrace, prevented him; and, supplanting his feet, drove him to the ground. Having snatched his sword, he stood with his foot on his neck, his club lifted to crush the vanquished champion, if he be not prevented by the king. The event of this exhibition was, not only to the Macedonians, but to Alexander, mortifying; chiefly because the Barbarians were pre sent; as he feared that the blazoned valor of the Macedonians would sink into derision. Hence the royal ear was open to the accusations of the envious…. Dioxippus could not endure glances from so many concurring eyes, by which he was marked out as a thief. After he had withdrawn from the entertainment, having written a letter to the king, he fell by his own sword.» First what kind of Dori is a Sarissa? Second, the Greeks rooted for Dioxippus, and the Macedonians couldn’t stand that the Greek won and harassed him to death One people, huh? Sort of reminds me how mad Hitler was when some Germans lost an Olympic mach to Greeks.
        » The kings of Macedon were accustomed thus to purify the troops. At the extremities of the field into which the army was to be led, the inwards of a bitch, cut in two, were de- posited by each party. In the intermediate space ranged all the forces, the cavalry on one side, the phalanx on the other» Oh right the Ancient Greeks cut dogs in half all the time….

        **************************************************
        LIVY
        » Philip himself, moved by a desire of enlarging his dominions, although he had suffered nothing whatever at the hands of the Romans, sent an embassy, the chief of which was Xenophanes, to Hannibal in Italy, proposing to aid him in Italy if he would promise to assist him in the subjugation of Greece.» Greece, not the rest of Greece. Enough said

        » decreed that all the Greek cities that had been under Philip’s rule should be free, and that he should withdraw his garrisons from them before the next celebration of the Isthmian games …. These conditions were added by the Senate and Philip accepted them all, by which it was made plain that those named by Flamininus were much too lenient. They sent to him as counsellors ten men (as was customary at the end of a war), with whose aid he should regulate the new acquisitions.
        When he had arranged these things with them he went to the Isthmian games, and, the stadium being full of people, he commanded silence by trumpet and directed the herald to make this proclamation, «The Roman people and Senate, and Flamininus, their general, having vanquished the Macedonians and Philip, their king, order that Greece shall be free from foreign garrisons, not subject to tribute, and shall live under her own customs and laws.» Thereupon there was great shouting and rejoicing and a scene of rapturous tumult; and groups here and there called the herald back in order that he might repeat his words for them.» Philip is made to remove his troops from Greece and….Greece shall be free from FOREIGN garrisons.

        «Then Antiochus went down to the Hellespont and crossed over to Chersonesus and possessed himself of a large part of Thrace by conquest or surrender. He freed the Greeks who were under subjection to the Thracians» Thracians vs Greeks

        «But the general concern was not so much for the Aetolians, who were more warlike than the rest of the Greeks, as for the liberty of Greece, which would be seriously endangered if Philip and his kingdom took an active part in Greek politics.» The politics of Greece, not the rest of Greece. Enough said

        » That around all these temples Philip had scattered his destructive flames, and left the images of the gods lying scorched and mutilated among the prostrated pillars of their fanes. Such as he had rendered the country of Attica, formerly opulent and adorned, such, if he were suffered, would he render Aetolia and the whole of Greece. That the mutilation of their own city, also, would have been similar, if the Romans had not come to its relief: for he had shown the same wicked rage against the gods who are the guardians of the city, and Minerva who presides over the citadel; the same against the temple of Ceres at Eleusis; the same against Jupiter and Minerva at Piraeus. In a word, having been repelled by force of arms, not only from their temples, but even from their walls, he had vented his fury on those sacred edifices which were protected by religion alone…….Then the Roman legate spoke as follows: «The Macedonians and then the Athenians have compelled me to alter entirely the address I was going to make. I came to protest against Philip’s wrongful action against all those cities of our allies, but the Macedonians by the charges they have brought against Rome have made me a defendant rather than an accuser. The Athenians, again, by their recital of his impious and inhuman crimes against the gods above and those below, have left nothing more for me or for any one else to bring up against him. Consider that the same things have been said by the inhabitants of Chios and Abydos, by the Aeneans, the Maronites, the Thasians, by the natives of Paros and Samos, of Larissa and Messene, and by the people over there in Achaia, and that those upon whom he was able to inflict most injury have made the gravest and most serious charges…. With respect to the charges against Philip-the bloodshed in his own family, the murders of his kinsmen and friends, his lust almost more inhuman than his cruelty-you who live nearest to Macedonia know most about them.» Enough said. Respect for the Greek Gods? Bull.

        » Amynander briefly stated his view, which was that the terms should be such that Greece should be sufficiently strong, even in the absence of the Romans, to protect her liberty and prevent the peace from being broken. The Aetolians spoke in a more vindictive tone… they went on to assure him that he was totally mistaken if he supposed that he would leave either peace with Rome or liberty for Greece on a sure basis unless Philip were either put to death or expelled from his kingdom. Either of these alternatives was easy for him if he chose to make full use of his victory. Quinctius replied that … You think that kings of Macedon are a danger to the liberties of Greece. If that nation and kingdom were swept away, Thracians, Illyrians, Gauls, savage and barbarous tribes, would pour into Macedonia and then into Greece. Do not, by removing the danger closest to you, open the door to greater and more serious ones.» Here he was interrupted by Phaeneas, the president of the Aetolian league, who solemnly declared amid great excitement that if Philip escaped then, he would soon prove a still more dangerous enemy.» Macedonians and Thracians are not Greek. Which is worse is debated.

        «Then indeed the Athenian people, whose hatred for Philip had long been restrained by fear, in view of the prospect of aid at hand, gave full vent to their anger. … They immediately proposed and the people passed a motion that all statues of Philip, all representations of him, and their inscriptions, and also those of his ancestors, male and female, should be removed and done away with, that all the feast-days, sacred observances and priesthoods which had been established in honor of him or his ancestors should be abolished; even the places in which any memorials or inscriptions in his honor had been set up should be accursed, and that it should not be lawful to place or dedicate in them thereafter anything that could lawfully be placed or dedicated in any unpolluted spot; the public priests, as often as they offered prayers on behalf of the people of Athens and their allies, their armies and fleets, should so often curse and execrate Philip, his children and his kingdom, his military and naval forces, and the whole race and name of the Macedonians.» I never heard them declare a Spartan or the Spartans in whole CURSED.

        ************************************************
        JOSEPHUS
        «These Egyptians, therefore, were the authors of these troubles, who not having the constancy of Macedonians, nor the prudence of Greeks, indulged all of them the evil manners of the Egyptians» Macedonians not Greeks again.
        «how much harder is to the Greeks, who were esteemed the noblest of all people under sun? These, although they inhabit a large country, are in subjection to six bundles of Roman rods. It is the same case with the Macedonians, who have juster reason to claim their liberty then you have.» And again, enough said.

        ***********************************************************
        JUSTIN
        «By which means it came to pass, that during the absence of exertion on the part of the Greeks, the name of the Macedonians, previously mean and obscure, rose into notice; and Philip, who had been kept three years as a hostage at Thebes, and had been imbued with the virtues of Epaminondas and Pelopidas, imposed the power of Macedonia, like a yoke of bondage, upon the necks of Greece and Asia» Macedonians are not Greeks, they brought a ZYGO not unity, and if the hostage is true, is that where Philip got the Argive descent thing?

        «Alexander, at the very beginning of his reign, purchased peace from the Illyrians with a sum of money, giving his brother Philip to them as a hostage.» blech.
        «WHEN Philip had once come into Greece, allured by the plunder of a few cities, and had formed an opinion, from the spoil of such towns as were of less note, how great must be the riches of all its cities put together, he resolved to make war upon the whole of Greece.» If Macedonia is part of Greece, he didnt come into Greece, he always was in it. greedy…
        «he made war upon the Athenians, of which he had long dissembled his intention. The Thebans espoused their cause, fearing that if the Athenians were conquered, the war, like a fire in the neighborhood, would spread to them. An alliance being accordingly made between the two cities, which were just before3 at violent enmity with each other, they wearied Greece with embassies, stating that “they thought the common enemy should be repelled by their common strength, for that Philip would not rest, if his first attempts succeeded, until he had subjugated all Greece.” …A battle being brought on, though the Athenians were far superior in number of soldiers, they were conquered by the valour of the Macedonians, which was invigorated by constant service in the field. They were not, however, in defeat, unmindful of their ancient valour; for, falling with wounds in front, they all covered the places which they had been charged by their leaders to defend, with their dead bodies. This day put an end to the glorious sovereignty and ancient liberty of all Greece… War being at an end in Greece, Philip directed deputies from all the states to be summoned to Corinth, to settle the condition of affairs. Here he fixed terms of peace for the whole of Greece, according to the merits of each city; and chose from them all a council, to form a senate as it were for the country. But the Lacedaemonians, standing alone, showed contempt alike for the terms and the king; regarding the state of things, which had not been agreed upon by the cities themselves, but forced upon them by a conqueror, as a state, not of peace, but of slavery. The number of troops to be furnished by each state was then determined, whether the king, in case of being attacked, was to be supported by their united force, or whether war was to be made on any other power under him as their general. In all these preparations for war it was not to be doubted that the kingdom of Persia was the object in view. The sum of the force was two hundred thousand infantry and fifteen thousand cavalry. Exclusive of this number there was also the army of Macedonia, and the adjacent barbarians of the conquered nations. »
        Macedonian troops are not counted among the blood tax Philip exacted from Greece just like the ADJACENT BARBARIANS are not. His victory is SLAVERY TO ALL GREECE, and her men his puppets.
        «To Philip succeeded his son Alexander… The father would dissemble his resentment, and often subdue it; when the son was provoked, there was neither delay nor bounds to his vengeance. … A battle often sent away Philip wounded; Alexander often left a banquet stained with the blood of his companions. The one wished to reign with his friends, the other to reign over them. The one preferred to be loved, the other to be feared.» Im sure the Greeks breathed relief…. NOT!
        «Such an arrangement being made, Antipater was appointed governor of Macedonia and Greece; the charge of the royal treasure was given to Craterus;» Enough said.
        «AFTER the death of Pyrrhus, there were great warlike commotions, not only in Macedonia, but in Asia and Greece» Greece, not the rest of Greece. Enough said

        ***************************************************

        I WILL gladly defend THE GREEKNESS OF MACEDONIA if IT IS INDEED HISTORICAL. PERSONALLY I WANT TO. HOWEVER EVERY ANCIENT SOURCE I CAN FIND DISAGREES.

        I will not lie just cause you have slandered me and threatened to rape and kill me. No GREEK runs and hides from barbarous thugs. NOR DO WE NEED TO STEAL OTHER PEOPLES’ HISTORY, WHEN WE HAVE SO MUCH AWESOME HISTORY OF OUR OWN.

        FINALLY —JUST TO CLARIFY…

        THERE IS NO NEED TO ARGUE NAMING RIGHTS. IF MACEDONIA WAS GREEK, AS FAS AS IM CONCERNED, NO, THEY DO NOT GET TO USE THE NAME. FINIS. AND IF THEY DONT LIKE IT, F THEM.

        THE ISSUE IS THAT AS FAR AS I CAN TELL, IT NEVER WAS. I WOULD LOVE FOR THIS TO BE PROVED WRONG. SOMETHING YOU CAN ONLY DO WITH AT LEAST AS MUCH IN ANCIENT SOURCES THAT STATE THE OPPOSITE.

        TO DATE, YOU HAVE DENIED MY GREEK IDENTITY BECAUSE IT SUITS YOU — JUST SO YOU KNOW, BUDDIES, IM PURER-BLOODED GREEK THAN A FEW OF YOU, AND MY KIDS WILL BE GREEK ON BOTH SIDES TOO-

        AND ALL YOU PRODUCE IS SLANDER, ACCUSATIONS, THREATS OF RAPE VIOLENCE AND DEATH IF I DONT SHUT UP AND STOP STUDYING, A PERFECTLY USELESS UNSOURCED BLOG, AND ABSOLUTELY NOTHING THAT EVEN TRIES TO PROVE ANYTHING.

        Μου αρέσει!

  2. καποιος said

    Γιδια,ξερετε ποσα χρονια τους λενε μακεδονια?Ολα αυτα τα χρονια αυτοι κανουνε το παιγνιδι τους,και εσεις τριβατε το καβλι σας.Αργει να βαρεσει η μαλακια,αλλα βαραει κατακεφαλα.Τωρα ρουφηχτε το,μαγκακια.

    Μου αρέσει!

    • Κάποιος κάπου κάποτε. Δεν είδα δεν ξέρω. Είμαι αθώος. Κλαψ - Λυγμ... said

      Κι’ εσύ τόσα χρόνια διερύγνυες τα ιμάτιά σου, υπέρ βωμών και εστιών… Σε θυμάμαι!
      Ουστ ρε καραγκιόζη, που τάπαιρνες από Σημίτηδες και Σαμαροβενιζέλους και δεν έβγαζες άχνα!

      Μου αρέσει!

  3. Grecian Rider said

    @ Koν Γ.Π.Τ.

    Η πραγματικότητα που αυτό συμβαίνει είναι διότι η ενδεχόμενη αναγνώριση από την Ελλάδα ως άμεσα ενδιαφερόμενης χώρας «δεν είναι η μόνη που μετράει «περισσότερο» (όπως with all due respect εσφαλμένα αναφέρετε) αλλά η μόνη που μετράει 100%, απλούστατα διότι καμία απο τις χώρες αυτές δεν συνορεύει με το ψευτοκρατίδιο και να έχει και Αιγαίο απο κάτω, ούτε και έχουν δει ποτέ εδάφη τους να περιλαμβάνονται σε δικούς του αλυτρωτικά παραχαραγμένους χάρτες.

    Πολύ δε περισσότερο ως μέλη και βάσει του καταστατικού του ΟΗΕ, τα κράτη αυτά δεν έχουν την ισχύ της απαρτίας του ώστε να μπορούν να αποφασίζουν ή να αναγνωρίζουν οτιδήποτε χωρίς την εγκρισή του.

    Μου αρέσει!

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